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LTE: The real cost of not building the connector

I just read yet another letter bemoaning the cross-county connector [”What’s the real cost of the cross-county connector?” Maryland Independent, June 5], written again by someone who does not live on or near Billingsley Road.

The primary benefit of the cross-county connector is that it will absorb most of the traffic that currently uses old Billingsley Road.

Posted by: Sammy on 06/10/09 at 02:34 PM

Page 1 of 1 pages

1. · He fails to mention the irreversible environmental degradation to the Mattawoman watershed, one of the last remaining pristine areas in the entire coastal region.

Also he doesn't address the water supply that will certainly be adversely impacted by the thousands upon thousands of new homes that will result from the connector.

First and foremost, he fails to mention the enormous COST - to be completely funded by the Charles County taxpayers - nothing from the state!

I like Mr. Rutherford, in fact I supported him several years ago when he ran for Commissioner - but on this issue, I think he's wrong...

Comment by cheryl on 06/11/09 at 05:52 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
2. · I know John personally and many years ago, he and I worked togther for the same firm after we retired from the Air Force, I too, supported him for his run for office. I believe he traverses this road on a frequent basis (I think, I'm not positive)and if correct he holds views of the issue that are somewhat "personally" generated ! I would expect those who do use the road on a fequent basis to have a different approach to solving the traffic problems. I am sure the traffic problem needs some kind of "fixing" but the CCounty taxpayers should not shoulder the entire "fix" bill !!

Comment by anserman on 06/11/09 at 06:50 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
3. · Good point anserman!

Upgrades to Billingsley would go a long way towards addressing the traffic problems without adversely affecting the Mattawoman.

IMO the primary reason for the Connector is to accommodate more development, both along the Connector itself, and in the Bryans Road/Indian Head areas as well as to serve the expanded Maryland Airport.

The cost of upgrading Billingsley would be a fraction of the cost of the Connector!!

Comment by cheryl on 06/11/09 at 07:23 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
4. · Projecting horrible sensationalized fear mongering images of overturned school buses is a cheap and tawdry tactic to promote the CCC. It has been said- The last vestige of-for other ulterior motives- scoundrels is to hide behind children....

The CCC will promote much more traffic density sprawl and devlopment===much more human volume on the roads..Insurance companies know traffic density and speed are the most dangerous accident catalyists-far surpassing any road design. That is why innsurance rates for motorists are higher in denser traffic areas. This is a fact. Like 301, the CCC will statistically bring much more carnage than Bilinsley road will ever realize..plain and simple statistical fact..

Mr. Rutherford's fear mongering vision of children's carnage on billingley road in support ofthe CCC is PATHETIC

Comment by WaterWorks on 06/13/09 at 10:20 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
5. · I also know John personally and have a great deal of respect for him. We are politically alligned on the same side of the aisle and I know that he is sincere. I know that he uses Billingsly Rd. every day and I can appreciate his viewpoint. My problem is that once completed, the CCC would attract housing developments like turds attract flies. When that happens, new dangers will await drivers on the four-lane highway. There will be a plethora of intersections (some controlled and some not) that will only invite a new collection of accidents. Crain Highway is currently the most dangerous road in Charles County. It got that way as a result of traffic volume and intersections. The fact that it is a four lane road with shoulders really has no impact (pardon the pun).

I have to admit that I don't know enough about the environmental impact of the CCC to speak intelligently about that subject. I defer to those that have a great deal more experience than me in this area. It does seem, however, that a complete EIS would put that issue to rest once and for all. Why not just do it?

WaterWorks, "fear mongering" is definately not John's style. He is genuine and can be trusted to speak from the heart. I used to travel Billingsly as a way to avoid some of the larger more congested roads on my way to and from work. I would often predict with uncanny accuracy which car ahead of me would wind up in the creek on the curve just before Cattle Place traveling East when it was raining. There are accidents, to be sure. I'm just not convinced that trading one dangerous situation for many others is the answer.

Comment by Birdman on 06/13/09 at 05:33 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
6. · "My problem is that once completed, the CCC would attract housing developments like turds attract flies. When that happens, new dangers will await drivers on the four-lane highway. There will be a plethora of intersections (some controlled and some not) that will only invite a new collection of accidents."

Has that been the case with Berry Road? If properly constructed, new dangers on a 4-lane highway don't happen. Unfortunately, the cars that are in front of you now on Billingsly Road that cause you concern just might be 1st time users of the road who don't realize that this road was constructed decades ago when there was little traffic and slower cars. Now, drivers expect curves and turns to be properly designed to navigate at the given speed and since Billingsly is not engineered to those standards it throws the unaccustomed driver for a loop (pardon the pun). As for encouraging future developments, just think a little bit. Have you ever driven down horrible country roads in Charles County that are more and more cluttered with new developments? Development is going to happen and it is not going to stop along Billingsly just because a better road is not built. I've never heard the argument that not improving roads is a way to stop development. If that were the case, we could stop development and only have cow-paths to travel on.

Comment by Iamangttia on 06/13/09 at 08:14 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
7. · Hey Iam, what's your "interest" in the CCC extension anyway?

If you're a real estate broker or a building contractor, I understand...8,000 new homes plus new commercial development will really increase that bottom line wouldn't it?

AGAIN, the only purpose of this COUNTY TAXPAYER FUNDED development corridor is to accommodate new development...
which will of course result in even more traffic...

With the estimated cost currently at $70M, we can expect this figure to rise to over $100M before all is said and done, and buddy, it's you and I, who will be on the hook - NOT the State and NOT the Fed - ONLY Charles County TAXPAYERS!

Comment by cheryl on 06/14/09 at 07:04 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
8. · "With the estimated cost currently at $70M, we can expect this figure to rise to over $100M before all is said and done, and buddy, it's you and I, who will be on the hook - NOT the State and NOT the Fed - ONLY Charles County TAXPAYERS!"

I would think that Charles County will take out a bond to pay for construction. Isn't that the way these things are done? If so, then our generation will begin paying back the bond and the next generation that will enjoy the improved corridor will pay their share. Isn't it our generation that is enjoying the Interstate Highway System enacted by President Eisenhower in the 50's that we would not now have if a previous generation said 'NO' to it?

Comment by Iamangttia on 06/14/09 at 10:48 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
9. · At the time Billingsly started building huge developments years ago- we who lived nearby asked why are they being approved- the roads are already bad; now they will be worse.

Even though I traveled those roads I and my neighbors did not want improvements (except the lowlying area that went underwater many times and we had to turn around and go another way (signs stating there was water over the road at the start of the road would have solved this in a low tech way). Why? We feared even more development would take place in a fragile area.

Of course we all know even more development did happen, but with none of the road improvements.

This is the fault of poor planning and approving development by the Government in an area not ready for it (but the development district could have absorbed it)and developers buiding in an area without the infrastructure needed.

This is a chronic problem of Charles County- dont put in the forsight to see the impact of developement and lack of infrastructure (schools, fire stations, roads) until years and years after the fact. Thats why we have had kids in overcrowded school conditions for way over 20 years.

It really is past time to be forward thinking, not paddling as fast as we can to catch up.

formerly known on the ‘Duck’ as spirit of the elder & BJGoodwin

Comment by Barbara on 06/14/09 at 04:56 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
10. · ""Forward thinking from this group of commissioners"" who think only about their immediate gratification and personal perks and travel and trappings and luxury retreats in their quest for the fastest and biggest bang for the buck -while they are able to make hay-with a subsidy pool of captive taxpayers to assist them in their own personal agendas.....is like having ice above 32Degrees F.-Not gonna happen-The can will only get kicked down the road on critical issues like water and repayment of massive cronied up govt or cronied up quasi private -govt bonorood deals...for da buds in da loop..

On another note--

Mr. Rutherrford may well be a fine upstanding man of moral and ethical confluence. However, in this instance -imho-projecting mental pictures of the carnage of children as a proponent of the CCC-whom nearly all CC residents oppose-and which will be the nail in the coffin to the Mattowoman WATERSHED..in the face of this road's rahter minimal accident history for the last -how many decades, compared to other much more accident prone routes is just too immediately a convenient and sensationally grotesque argument for the CCC --It is a prime example of fear mongering sensationalism -given the greater amount of accident carnage which exists on many other roadways within the county-.

Comment by WaterWorks on 06/15/09 at 11:50 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
11. · "This is the fault of poor planning and approving development by the Government in an area not ready for it (but the development district could have absorbed it)and developers buiding in an area without the infrastructure needed."

ABSOLUTELY!!

Ditto for the water supply - approving more and more development despite repeated warnings from USGS and MGS that we could experience "difficulties" (i.e. shortages) in the coming years...

Comment by cheryl on 06/16/09 at 07:34 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
12. · How many times have you been driving along a road and noticed that the traffic was unbearable? Then after miles of bumper-to-bumper, stop-and-go advances, you come across major road construction that has been making your commute a nightmare. What brought this about you say. Well, it was probably because the government did not think ahead and for one reason or another (probably a lack of money and taxpayer reluctance over the years) the road is just now being improved to meet reality. Guess what--you are on Billingsly Road just a few years from now! You can build it now or build it later at a higher price but, it will be built.

Comment by Iamangttia on 06/16/09 at 08:09 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
13. · Help with information please:

The President of the USA and the EPA announced that the Chesapeake is a National Treasure and MUST BE protected.

The new paradym is to treat the whole of the watershed as one; instead of regional areas of concerns that should be protected: but not all walk the talk.

This was a huge step in cleaning and retsoring the bay.

With this- couldnt this road be stopped? You guys that are in these organiztions- have you thought about fighting it this way? I know the CBF became involved and the focus is an endangered river- BUT have you now included this new initive in the fighting?

Seems to me this road shouldnt be built because it directly (development, impervious surfaces, runoff....) flies into the face of the new focus by the EPA and the President.

formerly known on the ‘Duck’ as spirit of the elder & BJGoodwin

Comment by Barbara on 06/16/09 at 10:15 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
14. · How is it that down South in places like Georgia and Mississippi there are probably hundreds of square miles of wetlands that are crossed by miles of causeways that have been there for many years without hurting the watersheds? In so many places, if roads across wetlands were not allowed, people would not be able to get from one place to another, even within their own State. How can these things be done there yet if the same thing were done across the Mattawoman it would be a total ecological disaster with every last bass egg destroyed. I just don't buy into this theory. I really believe that these arguments are just smoke-screens that people put forth to conceal their real concern and that is--more development.

Comment by Iamangttia on 06/16/09 at 10:30 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
15. · Contact the Mattawoman Watershed Society at mattawomanwatershedsociety.org.

They have a wealth of information!!

Comment by cheryl on 06/16/09 at 10:31 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
16. · Yes, the highways built through the Everglades are veritable MODELs for sensible environmentally sound building. Love the "get 'er done" approach in Louisiana too, where the Petrochemical industry has befouled and poisoned the air and water for decades.

Comment by Jack Wyatt on 06/16/09 at 11:00 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
17. · Maybe the Mattawoman Watershed Society should contact the two example States that I mentionned and find out from them how they can construct major highways across wetlands and still have wetlands teaming with life.

Comment by Iamangttia on 06/16/09 at 11:01 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
18. · "Yes, the highways built through the Everglades are veritable MODELs for sensible environmentally sound building. Love the "get 'er done" approach in Louisiana too, where the Petrochemical industry has befouled and poisoned the air and water for decades."

I've driven across the Everglades from Ft. Lauderdale to Naples many times. It's a wonderful highway and one that has not ruined the Everglades but has provided an easy 2-hour drive from East to West. Can you imagine how long it would take if Billingsly Road were transformed there? Also, I don't think a petrochemical plant is in store for Charles County and even if it were, it would be the petrochemical plant's responsibility to not do polluting--that's another matter that has nothing to do with improved roads in Charles County.

Comment by Iamangttia on 06/16/09 at 11:15 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
19. ·
It's a wonderful highway and one that has not ruined the Everglades but has provided an easy 2-hour drive from East to West.

The Everglades can't be developed either which helps protect it from various human contaminants, i.e. sewage and fertilizers.

Again, contact the Mattawoman Watershed Society with your comments and suggestions. They have the real environmental experts who can assist and inform you.

Comment by cheryl on 06/16/09 at 11:29 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
20. · I haven't heard anyone suggest that the Mattawoman be landfilled-over and opened for development either. The most infringement of it that I have heard is a couple hundred feet due to the new CCC. This would not amount to anymore than what was disturbed at the far end of Mattawoman-Beantown Road when it was completely re-built years ago. As far as development around the Mattawoman, just how many miles away from it are we to forbid development?

Comment by Iamangttia on 06/16/09 at 11:57 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
21. · Again, I must direct you to the MWS - Mr. Jim Long or Ms. Bonnie Bick.

I cannot pretend to be an expert on this, but Mr. Long and Ms. Bonnie Bick ARE experts and I'm certain they have the answers to your questions.

Comment by cheryl on 06/16/09 at 12:06 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
22. · 7 acres of Mattawoman is to be impacted.

formerly known on the ‘Duck’ as spirit of the elder & BJGoodwin

Comment by Barbara on 06/16/09 at 12:08 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
23. · This is from an article written by Tom Pelton in the Baltimore Sun last year:

"The four-lane, limited access road would replace 74 acres of forest with a strip of blacktop as it links proposed subdivisions to the malls in Waldorf.

Eleven subdivisions with 2,513 homes are proposed or under construction with the assumption they could connect to the new road. Another 27 subdivisions with 2,971 units are planned or built nearby. Further, about 2,400 homes are expected at the western end of the connector in the community in Bryans Road. The county says thousands more are likely to be built nearby."

The Spring 2009 issue of Smart Growth on Track published by 1000 Friends of Maryland reports:

"In the rural community of Bryans Road, the county has plans to build a new "town center" with more than 8,000 residential units. The proposed highway would connect Bryans Road with the malls of Waldorf, making land in the watershed far more vulnerable to development while discouraging future development in the county's already existing urban communities."

It also reports: "Maryland and U.S. leaders have gone to lengths to preserve the forested viewshed from Mount Vernon, which lies along the Potomac River. The Cross County Connector Extension is aimed squarely at the viewshed. If it's built, visitors to Mount Vernon would be greeted with a scar of ungainly highway-triggered sprawl."

Also, the nation's leading river conservation organization, "American Rivers" highlighted the Mattawoman in its annual list of "America's Most Endangered Rivers".

Comment by cheryl on 06/16/09 at 12:47 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
24. · Iaman... you're an apples to apples comparision guy. First, the Everglades are approximately 6,000,000 acres in total; the Mattawoman is about 76 acres. There are only two roads that cross the Everglades, Highway 41 and Interstate 75.

The government is spending BILLIONS to undo decades of damage to the Everglades. Just last year the government set aside $1.75 billion to reclaim 300 acres of the Everglades.

If you want examples of just how good the County has progressed on their stormwater runoff management go drive down Rosewick Road during or in the days after a decent rain. Facchina has been out there nearly every week re-digging the drainage ponds, the storm drains and the culverts. Rosewick, built across a swamp, was supposed to be one of their examples of their high-tech stormwater management process.

If they can't get it right across a swamp, that isn't a protected watershed, doesn't contain endangered species and isn't vital to the bass industry of our region, I don't want to take the chance that they might get it right there.

If it costs $1.75 billion to fix the mistakes of 300 acres in the Everglades, we might as well go ahead and start an account to fix the mistakes of the Mattawoman if we're going to build the CCC. Because when the times comes, its going to cost nearly that billion dollar mark.

Comment by The Quack on 06/16/09 at 01:09 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
25. · Iamggta skillfully weaves many a muddled road and twisted tenet in his advocacy for rampant growth and the CCC which he would have you believe will see little to no development past the highway. One has to be in a coma to believe such hyperbole and duplicity.

I am reminded of a quote from Queen Elizabeth 1 of England when I think of the Commissioners, their mouthpieces, and the other buds in da loop who worship at the alter of the biggest immediate bang for the buck at the neglect of all else that we have learned over the past decades about quality of life and responsible environmental stewardship..

""Those who have two strings on their bow may shoot stronger, but rarely do they shoot straight."" having access and control of the levers of govt and the local press and other mis-informational machines is a strong foe to topple...the opaqueness, misinformation, smoke and mirrors, feigned concern at pro forma hearings which always favor da biggest immediate bang for da buck for da incrowd-the sworn employment oaths of silence within the cloistered bubble of Comizar govt -like Queen Elizabeth 1 says -rarely evr shoot straight and honestly with the citizenry... .Absolute Power corrupts absolutely..The Fab Royal 5 are living proof..

Comment by WaterWorks on 06/16/09 at 01:13 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
26. · It is unlikely that MDE and the Army Corps of Engineers will approve the CCC based on what they were presented with by Charles County.

If they do however, there are several groups ready to pounce on it with lawsuits at both the state and federal level that would delay this for a very long time.

Comment by Ken Robinson on 06/16/09 at 01:18 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
27. · Quack - You are SO right about Rosewick and guess what? There are "plans" for several thousand new homes to be built there too!

Ken - I hope you're right - in fact I'll bet the EPA will weigh in on it too - if it hasn't already!

Comment by cheryl on 06/16/09 at 01:39 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
28. · "Maryland and U.S. leaders have gone to lengths to preserve the forested viewshed from Mount Vernon, which lies along the Potomac River. The Cross County Connector Extension is aimed squarely at the viewshed. If it's built, visitors to Mount Vernon would be greeted with a scar of ungainly highway-triggered sprawl."

Would almost be as unsightly as what the visitors to the Vatican have to look at beyond the plaza. Is there anything that some people would be willing to part with?

"the Mattawoman is about 76 acres." WHAT?

"The government is spending BILLIONS to undo decades of damage to the Everglades. Just last year the government set aside $1.75 billion to reclaim 300 acres of the Everglades."

Yes, I know that the Everglades has many problems but these two roads are not the cause.

I agree with Ken. The big deterent is that there will be no money in the foreseeable future for the CCC. This whole thread is completely academic at best and an experiment in futility at worst. But, the one thing that I think this thread does show is that there is probably nothing that any government can propose to do that special interest groups instantly arise to start fighting against it--and always on the most profound and moral grounds.

Comment by Iamangttia on 06/16/09 at 02:23 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
29. · sometimes things are irreplaceable.

sometimes we want those things perserved for our grandchildren.

I have watched as over 50 years the Potomac and its inlets have been befouled and ruined; mainly thru bad or no forthought as to the impact (after all its just one)and thru everyone wanting thier peice of the water.

Its time to make a stand on some things.

For me this is one.

The small peices all fit into the whole of repairing the Potomac and all its past beauty.

The health of our children and grandchildren also are at stake. PCB's and PBA's in our fish; mercury in fish; fish having both sex organs; oysters you cant eat because of contamination; the collapse of crab population. Sewage and bacteria in the water- that if you look close enough in publications and studies; tell you swim and recreational use of the river and bay is at your own risk. That should say a lot.

We have land set aside to build. Lets build where the infrastructure and transportation is.

Leave something of our world of wonder for our children and grandchildren to enjoy.

formerly known on the ‘Duck’ as spirit of the elder & BJGoodwin

Comment by Barbara on 06/16/09 at 03:06 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
30. · Hey Iam, don't kill the messenger!

I'm just passing along this info - if you don't agree, contact Tom Pelton (who is with the Bay Daily now) or contact 1000 Friends of Maryland.

But yes, the Mattawoman Watershed is very large and the Connector would directly and indirectly affect a large portion of it.

Visit MWS to learn more!!

Comment by cheryl on 06/16/09 at 03:25 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
31. · #4 Mr. Rutherford's fear mongering vision of children's carnage on billingley road in support ofthe CCC is PATHETIC

The safety issue is the only issue the Commissioners pounced on to try and make a case for the spending of 70 mill or so of CC taxpayer dollars for this road to nowhere. Just goes to show how little regard the Commissioners have for human life seein' as how Billingsley is "oh, so unsafe" yet they've done nothing to demand simple upgrades with viable signage.

As for Rutherford's comment, he sounds like a Commissioner toady!

Comment by seahorse on 06/16/09 at 03:30 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
32. · #26 It is unlikely that MDE and the Army Corps of Engineers will approve the CCC

I feel the same, and hope the CCC gets knocked down permanently.

Comment by seahorse on 06/16/09 at 03:34 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
33. · "sometimes we want those things perserved for our grandchildren."

No argument here. The problem with the Bay and the Potomac has nothing to do with a well thought out CCC that doesn't do harm and at the same time provides your children and grandchildren (if, indeed they decide to stay in Charles County) a safe corridor that can handle the increased traffic that will multiply every year between now and the time that it is constructed. I remember going down to Captain Johns at Cobb Island to eat steamed crabs or to have a delicious seafood platter and then going out on the pier and seeing the unimaginable floating all over the water. This was years ago before Swan Point and before Cobb Island became the "in place" for successful 60's hippies. Once development began in earnest on Cobb Island and at Swan Point, the need for an improved sewage system became apparent. It was built; people were forced to connect to it and now you don't have to be afraid to view the water down at Captain Johns. This is my example of how development can, does and will continue to be the driving force in improving the Bay, the Potomac and yes, even the Mattawoman. This is because developers know that their clients will accept nothing less.

Comment by Iamangttia on 06/16/09 at 05:50 PM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
34. · #33
''SOMETIMES WE WANT THOSE THINGS PRESERVED FOR OUR GRANDCHILDREN'from previous well thought out post- -MORPHS INTO--as only the imanttosilly can do ...

''THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF HOW DEVELOPMENT CAN,DOES, AND WILL CONTINUE TO BE THE DRIVING FORCE IN IMPROVING THE BAY''

YOU ARE USUALLY MORE SKILLFUL THAN THIS WITH YOUR mis directional CRAFT -iamtta-this time you are just plain SILLY..

Comment by WaterWorks on 06/17/09 at 06:42 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]
35. ·
As for Rutherford's comment, he sounds like a Commissioner toady!
Seahorse, I will stake my own reputation on the fact that this is not the case! Anyone who knows John knows that ousting the Fab 5 would please him immensely.

Comment by Birdman on 06/17/09 at 11:34 AM | [Back to Top] | [Back to Main]

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